Big problem with AE CS3 - abnormal slow with nvidia 8800 GTS 512 !

[R***@adobeforums.com]

Hi! So what's the deal now with this issue? Is there going to be a fix or at least a reply? This is a problem to anybody with a quadcore cpu, a geforce 8800 based card (yes, also quadro cards) on windows (at least xp, not sure about vista).

Please someone official reply!

Cheers,

Ronny

[J***@adobeforums.com]

Ronny,

This is a User-to-User forum, so don't expect an official reply.

This problem affects users on both XP and OS X, but has been reported to cause no problems on Vista on the same hardware. The hard part is that it only affects certain combinations of hardware so the problem is hard to reproduce and solve.

I discussed this with an engineer yesterday that informed me that you need to contact Adobe's (free) support via telephone, to open a support case for this. Shouting in forums and mailing lists won't do you any good.

So, please, call Adobe's support today if you have this problem, which has also been reported to cause problems with Premiere Pro, Cinema 4D and other 3D softwares!

- Jonas Hummelstrand
<http://generalspecialist.com/>

[B***@adobeforums.com]

from sources i have this problem is EASY to reproduce on any quad based systems both xp 32/64 or vista. i dont know about osx and so far we reported this to adobe so there is only hope and until than i have my latest 8800 gts sitting back next to me doing nothing since i cant use it with my system

[T***@adobeforums.com]

I had the exact same problem, no directdraw support in AE interface. The problem not just occur on Q6600 & 8800GTS, on any system with nvidia recent display quadro or geforce are affected, due to directdraw has been broken by 16x.xx nvidia drivers (except 165.21 if I remember correctly it still works with AE directdraw).

I have an older geforce7800 and quadroFX3400 running driver 91.36 and it was fine with directdraw and AE.

those of you having unaccelerated AE interface should also notice this problem, quicktime.qts would crash if access by other apps as plugin, such as web browers when calling that to play mov. even when doing a quicktime update from the qt interface would crash qt as soon as the update requester pops up.
seriously, Nvidia 16x.xx is to be avoided for the time being.

furthermore I tried putting in a ATI HD3870 into the same Q6600 system and it was fine in AE with catalyst8.3 driver.

Display drivers are getting crappier these days.

[V***@adobeforums.com]

Problem is fixed in the newest NVidia BETA drivers 177.66. They are not available on the nvidia site (latest I could find is 177.41) so google it. Ignore the fact that they are "for the GTX200 series", the .inf contains way more device profiles than just the GTX 260 and 280. I guess NVidia just wants you to run out and buy a new video card even though the 8800 series is on AE's list of supported cards...

I'm using an 8800 GT on WinXP x32 SP3. Was ready to pay the "convenience fee" associated with buying from my local big name retail electronics store just to get whatever ATi card they're pushing so that I could meet my deadline. Good thing I took a chance on shady software instead! Been editing for about an hour so far and the UI is every bit as slick as it should be. Haven't tried Encore CS3 (supposedly has the same problem) because I don't have it installed, so I don't know if this is a hotfixed workaround for AE, or if NVidia actually fixed DirectDraw.

[s***@adobeforums.com]

ARE YOU SERIOUS!? coz so far, ive been working in AE with an 'ok' response time. Im too scared to destroy whatever fluke settings that might have happened during the OS / AE / Driver / installation process. But if its working for you Victor, good stuff, Id probably wait for someone else to confirm this as well...

Thanks Victor...

[D***@adobeforums.com]

Hmmm.... Interesting... I check this driver soon and write here about this.

(Âèêòîð, à ññûëêó íà ñòðàíè÷êó ãäå áðàë äðàéâåðà - ïîäêèíåøü? :) )

[s***@adobeforums.com]

DUDE, YOU JUST NAILED IT! It's all cool on my end:D Finally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It took 4 Months....

[D***@adobeforums.com]

YES! Its really works! 177.66 & AE works fine!
Finally! ;)

[M***@adobeforums.com]

I've had this problem also (twice).
I'm running QuadroFX 4600 on XP x64, just installed 176.04_quadro_winxp64_english_whql drivers.
Launch of AECS3 shows much improved responsiveness.
Much less aggravating, but haven't tested thoroughly...

[R***@adobeforums.com]

Hi! I have 8800GTX serie XXX, Pentium D Dual core 3,0 and Asus P5K-SE with 2GB 800mhz. Well, its work fine, no problem about slow. But, I want to buy another processor, maybe Core2 Extreme.
Well, I'll have some problem with AE CS3?
Thanks.
Roma

[M***@adobeforums.com]

I'd predict that you won't, but don't even think of holding me to it.
You just have to try it out.

[S***@adobeforums.com]

Any updates on this issue folks? Any news?

[S***@adobeforums.com]

Anyone tried the 175.16 drivers or is this 177.66 posted by Victor Boruta????

Just found this 177.92 Beta as well in the Beta/Archive section of the Nvidia site. Anyone tried these?

[D***@adobeforums.com]

With 177.92 8800GTS512 - work fine :)

[S***@adobeforums.com]

OK, I've got 177.92 installed. What settings do you guys use in AE for Previews?

Fast Previews:
Adaptive Resolution Limit: ??
Enable OpenGL: ??
Accelerate Effects Using: ??
Texture Memory: ??

And in your Comp Window, what Fast Preview mode do you use?: Off, Adaptive, WireFrame, OpenGL Interactive or OpenGL Always On?

What other settings impact the 8800GT 512's performance with AE.
Thanks for the input!

[D***@adobeforums.com]

Fast Previews:
Adaptive Resolution Limit: 1/4 (default)
Enable OpenGL: OFF (turn it always off)
Accelerate Effects Using: Adaptive Resolution
Texture Memory: 200 (against VRAM size)

In your Comp Window: Adaptive

[M***@adobeforums.com]

My system has a 8600GTS 320MB (latest beta drivers) running on an intel dual core. If it really is hardware related then it's either the 8800 line or the quad CPU.

[B***@adobeforums.com]

amazing i am fed up of this how much do we need to wait for proper solution.... using beta drivers is kind of icing on cake... i can work in AE but now here and there i get wieports refresh problem in other apps.....

[T***@adobeforums.com]

Berislav, care to mention what other apps that you've encounter viewport refresh problem? I too am fed up of all these drivers crap.

[M***@adobeforums.com]

I just tried 178.28 (with CUDA support) with AFX CS4 and MAN is it slow as hell with creation, transformation, and even moving simple shapes in the comp window.

Is 177.92 still working for everyone who has had this problem previously in CS3? Apparently the bug has migrated into CS4 with its hatred for the 8800 series.

I can't use the product like this. It's like I'm running a GEF4800 card hehe.

Here are my specs rundown....

CS4 Master
ASUS P5G Q6600 @ 2.4
GEF 8800 GTX 768 (178.28 drivers)
4 gig Kingston RAM

Hopefully my games and other 3D apps such as 3ds max won't be pissed if i have to downgrade to a lower driver version.

Thanks for any help.

[C***@adobeforums.com]

Hey Matt,

Please open a support issue on this so we can work with you more effectively.

--chris

[C***@adobeforums.com]

I just spoke to several people who've been looking at this issue for ages. We can't reproduce it on any machine we own. We have those cards, we have tested them, and they all work OK here. There are users who have them and they work just fine. Which is all very frustrating, more so for you.

Please don't take that to mean there isn't a problem. Clearly there is, we just haven't figured out what yet. Oddly enough most people don't want to send us their machines. We had another problem last year, which ended up being a crash on a single machine with a particular card. Luckily the machine was just somewhere else in adobe (I think Japan), and they were able to ship it to us and we fixed the bug.

My latest guess, is maybe it's something wrong with the card that AE is tickling? If you are up for it, drop a line to ***@adobe.com and we'll swap your card with one that is working for us.

--chris

[M***@adobeforums.com]

Hi Chris,

Thanks for the reply. It seems rather apparent to me that it is the driver I am using for several reasons. The machine I'm running AE CS4 on has a brand new motherboard, RAM, the works. Freshly formatted XP SP3. The only thing that is not new is my graphics card, which works great for every other application I own and use, including 3dsMax which alot of my scenes have upwards of 1,000,000 polygons showing with steady framerates. A faulty card would punk out on something of that magnitude.

However, AE runs FLAWLESSLY on my server rig, which is HALF speed (core duo, only 2 gig ram, GEF 7800).

So in my mind it clicks that it has to be either the Nvidia drivers I am using or my quad core (had there been any trouble with quad before?).

Unfortunately I won't send you my graphics card haha. That's an awkward request from a support team, but, thanks for the offer.

Hopefully the additional info I provided helps you guys see whats up. I haven't tried the driver downgrade yet, but I will if you need me to test them to see what is causing this issue. Thanks again,

--Matt

[M***@adobeforums.com]

Hey Matt, do you have a copy of AECS3 to test on that system? It would be interesting to see if you have the same issues...

I've had this problem twice in the past, using the same NVidia card but w/various versions of the drivers - I have to agree w/Matt that it is a driver issue.
As you can see from my post above, in Sept. I installed the 176.04_quadro_winxp64_english_whql version of the drivers and AE has been performing great since then. Previous to the release of those drivers, AE was noticeably clunky - and to no avail I tried various openGL settings in the NVidia control panel to resolve the issue.
Because AE is critical to my workflow, I'm hesitant to upgrade the graphics drivers... I'm also hesitant to upgrade to CS 4.

I understand the challenge this presents to the AE development team if the problem only occurs w/a certain % of users (though I wonder what % it is, because I don't know if everyone would notice and I don't know how many users are also doing 3D (or gaming) on the same system and therefore have a high performance graphics card).

Since the issues generally involve the smoothness of AE's interface (even as mundane as switching comps), would it be possible to add a few more switches to control how AE takes advantage of the hardware openGL?

[M***@adobeforums.com]

Hey Mitch,

Yeah CS3 does the same thing but only on my systems having 8800 cards. It is a shame. I can use my server rig, which isnt really tuned for large renders, for the time being but something has to be done about this, even if it's a small percentage of people.

If it is NVidias problem, which it kind of seems like, well then.. I doubt anything will come of that from such a small trouble base. I could downgrade to Quadro drivers but then half of my other apps such as 3ds max 09' will complain about it Im certain. Thanks for the tip though on the Quadro drivers. I had tried the GEF 200 series drivers someone else mentioned and that didnt work so maybe this will. Otherwise I will just use AE on my server rack for now.

[M***@adobeforums.com]

I copied this out of the latest promo from Creative Cow:
"NVIDIA and Adobe together invest significant engineering hours to test and optimize Quadro solutions, so there is less likelihood of an issue interrupting your workflow. Quadro graphics solutions are designed and optimized by NVIDIA to ensure your system works when you need it. With an extended product life cycle of up to 36 months, Quadro lets you standardize on a supported system for a longer period of time."
Hmmm...

[B***@adobeforums.com]

ok lets not stop here ... although latest drivers fix speed issue in AFX we are now hit but almost same annoying bug...
I feel like in one way street..
now we get problems with photoshop cs3/illustrator cs3 window interface refresh.
If some of 3d apps like 3Dsmax or Lightwave is open and run in background it is impossyble to work with pshop and illustrator cs3.
As soon i close 3d apps refresh comes back and pshop/illustrator works.... i think there must be something wrong with refresh algorithm ADOBE products use (specially ogl side of code)...
So my pipeline looks this way now afx cs3 and photoshop/illustrator cs 2.
this way all works ...
sad we have to jump to various solutions just to get something work out...
and i do not blame this is just adobe problem to solve.. but more NVIDIA one... nvidia start to make crap drivers and that is really bad now... they joined ati camp .. great

[R***@adobeforums.com]

This is a show of hands. I tried to upgrade, the software installed but failed at the point where I needed to enter the license numbers. The online tech had me do some fancy CTRL ALT something while clicking in a secret part of the screen after he verified my numbers but it still didn't work. That was 5 months ago.

Since I was working on a project I didn't want to take any more chances so to this date I am still running CS3. Having said that, I have been experiencing a severe slowdown of After Effects and I am getting interesting application memory errors when exiting both Premiere and AE.

I just uninstalled CS4 but after reading this information I think I will still be haunted.

Dell 490
Windows XP sp3
2 - Quad Xeon 2.66
NVidia Quadro FX 4600
1 - WD Raptor 150gb 10,000rpm boot
3 - WD Raptor 300gm 10,000rpm Raid O - 3Ware 4650SE 4 port Raid card

[M***@adobeforums.com]

I just bit the bullet and upgraded from my 8800 to a GEF 260, and shifted from XP to VistaX64 and all the CS4 products work flawlessly.

An occasional crash but nothing that impedes my work. It's a shame though that I had to shell out a couple hundred bucks to use especially After Effects. But after I got used to its slowness I started to have more problems with performance in Photoshop as well and that was a bad thing for texture creation and work timelines.

Just wanted to let everyone know that I couldn't find a solution (permanent one) to this problem other than upgrading the GFX card and the OS.

[R***@adobeforums.com]

Just a follow up to my note on AE CS3 slowing down after installation of CS4. Yes is was brutally slow, however after uninstalling CS4 and reading General Specialists list of things to try: <http://generalspecialist.com/2007/02/troubleshooting-after-effects-7.asp>

All I did was to delete the AE preferences file by pressing Ctrl, Shift, Alt just after I select AE from the program menu and voilà, amazing difference. It is now performing as is should.